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This article is rated PG-13 for strong use of language.

Dear Mr. Goyer,

Truthfully I’m not even sure where to begin in this letter to you that you’ll probably never actually read. I guess I should start by saying that quite frankly, I don’t truly care if you ever do read this as it more or less is here to serve as a placeholder for my thoughts on your disgusting comments and behavior.

The Mary Sue published an article this afternoon that was forwarded to me and completely unprepared for what awaited me, I opened it while shopping around a bookstore. It was your thoughts on She-Hulk as a character and would later go on to address your thoughts towards fans of the comic book world. Your thoughts that you shared on a podcast called Scriptnotes that was recorded in front of a live audience where this conversation happened:

Craig Mazin: The real name for She-Hulk was Slut-Hulk. That was the whole point. Let’s just make this green chick with enormous boobs. And she’s Hulk strong but not Hulk massive, right? … She’s real lean, stringy…

David S. Goyer: She’s still pretty chunky. She was like Chyna from the WWE.

Mazin: The whole point of She-Hulk was just to appeal sexistly to ten-year-old boys. Worked on me.

Goyer: I have a theory about She-Hulk. Which was created by a man, right? And at the time in particular I think 95% of comic book readers were men and certainly almost all of the comic book writers were men. So the Hulk was this classic male power fantasy. It’s like, most of the people reading comic books were these people like me who were just these little kids getting the shit kicked out of them every day… And so then they created She-Hulk, right? Who was still smart… I think She-Hulk is the chick that you could fuck if you were Hulk, you know what I’m saying? … She-Hulk was the extension of the male power fantasy. So it’s like if I’m going to be this geek who becomes the Hulk then let’s create a giant green porn star that only the Hulk could fuck.

Let me address your comments in a way that I feel you will understand: Fuck you. Fuck you 1000x over. Your comments are so disrespectful and so utterly disgusting that even if I hadn’t heard any other part of the talk, I would’ve immediately wished I could take back every single penny that I’ve ever put towards something you’ve worked on in the industry. I wish that I could take back every single second that I’ve spent watching something that had your name attached to it. Most of all, I wish that you had nothing more to do with any property that I’ve ever loved.

I am so repulsed by the thought of your sexist words being used to write Wonder Woman onto the big screen for the first time ever. I can’t imagine a bigger sense of dread for the future of one of the female comic book icons that’s been around since 1941. I can’t imagine how few words it’ll take for you to destroy this prestigious character and to continue to ensure that DC will never ever take her seriously and give her the representation that she is so deserving of.

I rage tweeted for the better part of the afternoon and couldn’t shake the anger that you infected me with. How dare you say those things about anybody or anything, even if she is a fictional character. These are established characters that are beloved to many, many people… many of which indirectly sign your paycheque by going to see your movies. She-Hulk isn’t “an extension of the the male power fantasy” she’s a character that has depth and that despite having Hulk superpowers is incredibly relatable. She’s smart and is an incredible lawyer. The other Avengers know that she is powerful as She-Hulk but they also know the person behind the green giant is a human that has flaws and problems and other things that she works through every single day. She-Hulk oftentimes represents who are shy and meek and yearn to be sexy, confident and proud. Someone who holds their head up high and takes shit from no one.

Your misconceptions about She-Hulk are exactly the reason why you will never work for Marvel. Captain America will continually be passing you on your left, so to speak.

Comic book movies don’t need to be taken so seriously and written into a gritty story that involve brooding and murderous main characters. The Avengers proved that you can just take a well written story straight out of a comic and have a blockbuster hit.

I haven’t even gotten around to the part where you were asked about Martian Manhunter and responded with this bit of business (quoted from The Mary Sue article):

“How many people in the audience have heard of Martian Manhunter?” After hearing some light applause and cheers, he added, “How many people that raised their hands have ever been laid?”

I’m not even going to address this other than once again, how DARE you speak about our favourite characters like this and how DARE you assume we’re all virgin basement dwellers. For the record, I have not only heard of Martian Manhunter but I’ve read comics WITH Martian Manhunter and I am not a basement dweller virgin, you pompous fuckweasel.

In a perfect world, you would be taken off of the comic book properties that you’re working on. In a perfect world, you wouldn’t be allowed to work on any other comic book properties ever again. In a perfect world, you wouldn’t have already gotten so far ahead in your career. But that’s not the case and I know that you make too much money for DC for them to fire you, which is a real fucking shame.

I may not live in a perfect world and the movies I could potentially love like Batman vs. Superman: Dawn of Justice (which is a really stupid fucking name, by the way) are still being made by hateful people like you, but that doesn’t mean that I have to help contribute to your success.

Fuck you. Fuck your movies. Fuck your career. Both Hollywood and comics deserve better than you. Have a nice fucking day.

Stephanie Cooke aka a fan of She-Hulk, Martian Manhunter, Batman, Superman, Wonder Woman and all the other characters you’ve trashed and/or destroyed on screen.

PS – Sorry for all the name calling but you should honestly consider not being a huge fucking asshole.

PPS – Just as an FYI, Hulk and She-Hulk are cousins, so I guess by saying that they should essentially be fuck buddies, you’re condoning incest. COOL. I doubt you’d be so inclined as to educate yourself for the sake of women everywhere (and just for the sake of general geekdom), but if so, check out Dan Slott’s run on She-Hulk. You may also want to consider taking some writing tips from him and/or Charles Soule who is writing the current run on She-Hulk and is doing an absolutely fantastic job. I would also keep a close eye any characters that She-Hulk may pummel in upcoming issues as I wouldn’t be surprised to find a likeness of you somewhere in the mix.

PPPS – Fuck you. Just need to get a final one in there.

About The Author

Managing Editor, Community Manager and Podcast Co-Host

Stephanie is [obviously] a comic book fan, but she also considers herself an avid gamer, movie watcher, lover of music, board games fan (although she doesn’t find nearly enough time for them…) and being snarky. Oh, and Twitter. Twitter’s a hobby, right? Stephanie is a purveyor of too many projects and outside of Talking Comics she’s done work for, Agents of Geek, Word of the Nerd, C&G Magazine, Dork Shelf, Misfortune Cookie (her personal blog for words and pictures) and more. She wrote a story for the anthology The Secret Loves of Geek Girls (coming in October 2016 from Dark Horse) and she also runs Toronto Geek Trivia in her home city. She can be found helping out at other “geek” community things around there.

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10 Responses

  1. James Hammond

    I really need someone at DC/WB to call him out on his bullshit.

    I’m tired of the apoligists, excuse makers and sycophants who seem determind to justify him. Does anyone have the guts to say he is wrong? Snyder maybe?

  2. Matt

    Goyer is a piece of shit who’m I’ve had a strong dislike for for quite some time. He can take his mediocre films and shove em.

  3. Bob Reyer

    As you’ve all certainly realized by now, I’m not one who uses much profanity, but Stephanie may have found the perfect use for it here in channeling her rage!

    This may not frame the debate in a classic sense, but this primal approach more directly conveys the outrage so many of us feel about the portrayal of, and attitudes about, female characters and readers. If this can bring about more open discussions into these issues , perhaps the firestorm will grow hot enough that some of The Powers That Be over at DC, Warner’s (and any of the rest who haven’t “gotten the memo” yet!) will finally understand that there are other readers and consumers of their products than their oft-stated target of “25 to 45 year-old men”?

    Sadly, to top things off, as was Janelle Asselin, our Ms. Cooke has now had to fend off the usual hordes of cowardly internet ignoramuses who hide behind their shadow cloaks of anonymity to foist attacks upon women who dare to have a divergent opinion from their “alpha-male” own. They either leap to defend the indefensible comments of Mr. Goyer, with statements such as “He was joking; get over it!”, when we all know that humour often reflects a person’s inner thoughts, setting them free in a manner similar to “in vino veritas“, or they descend into the gutter with vile comments that have no place in our society.

    My esteemed colleague Ms. Cooke, I surely join everyone here in the Talking Comics family in offering our good wishes, and our support!

  4. mikeman1090

    I liked Man of Steel and was genuinely excited for the cinematic universe and I would even go so far as to defend Goyer or at least convince people to put a little faith in him. However, after his statement, I really can’t defend anymore. I’m super annoyed and disheartened by his statement, especially knowing that he was creative control over the characters. He practically gave a middle finger to comic books and fans and it seems that, since he’s a screenwriter, he thinks he’s above comic books. Also, I cannot believe that Geoff Johns, one of my favorite writers, would work with this asshole on anything comic book related! I’m still excited for the cinematic universe and BvS but… I hope DC gets rid of Goyer soon. Maybe they can have Chris Terrio instead since he’s re-writing Goyer’s script anyways. In the end, coming from a person who was 100% on board with BvS and the rest of the cinematic universe, Goyer has definitely lost a fan.

  5. thisjohnd

    Not that it matters, but the hosts of this podcast sounded pretty immature as well.

    Stephanie, your line about Captain America passing Goyer on his left was the highlight of your open letter. That’s not to say the rest of it was for naught, but that line perfectly sums up the state that Goyer and DC are in when compared to Marvel. They’re targeting their films at 18 year old boys and clearly at least someone over there thinks like one as well.

    I’m not about to boycott all of Goyer’s stuff because unfortunately, the Dark Knight trilogy is still the best comic book movies have ever been, but it’s sad to see that someone with such a backward sensibility is getting paid to write superhero films. I’m sure he was joking about the whole “virgins” line but it’s the kind of joke that is so outdated in today’s landscape that it amazes me someone would fall back on it for humor purposes.

  6. David

    I think Goyer’s attitude is right in line with the party line over at WB/DC. Look at the DC titles, are there any strong independent-minded females with or without their own titles? You might be able to make a case for some characters but at best they’re satellite characters, overly sexualized or a lesbien. Is this what DC believes? That any woman with inner strength has to either have a tragedy happen (Oracle), be defined by their relationship to a man (Black Canary, Catwoman, Huntress, Lois Lane, etc.) or not be heterosexual (Batwoman)?
    It’s a travesty that the publisher who had one of the first feminist characters in Wonder Woman has gone the route of pandering to the lowest common denominator in the sexist tendencies of too many young males in North America, then again I shouldn’t be surprised when they turned Wonder Woman into Conan with estrogen.
    I am seriously considering not watching SvsB just because of Goyer’s comments (joking or no).

  7. benjiman_1981

    As I mentioned in the forum, Chris Terrio was hired to re-write SvB over 6 months ago so Goyer doesn’t have as much influence on the film as everyone keeps saying. This is a stupid man saying stupid things, it’s not a reason to bash a film that hasn’t even come out yet that he wrote an original draft for.

    • Stephanie Cooke

      Sure he’s a “stupid man saying stupid things” but he’s also the man responsible for bringing some of DC’s most beloved characters to the big screen for the first time ever and when he openly bashes characters in any universe, Marvel or otherwise, it’s disrespectful to the community that’s gotten him where he is today. Additionally, his comments about fans who knew about Martian Manhunter are unacceptable. Maybe he’s not as involved as he was, but he’s still the Joss Whedon of the DC movies. He’s overseeing everything and you better believe that he’ll have a say in what’s to come.

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